Talk:Berserk/@comment-65.28.183.104-20190715211018

Having seen all of the comments about the Berserk being strong and weak at the same time, I can see both sides though after looking at the issue from multiple angles, think they need some work.

On their own Elite Berserks are strong units, especially with their regeneration, unique techs, cheap cost and average health. They cost 5 more food and 5 less gold less than other unique units such as the Jaguar Warrior, Kamayuk and Samurai, and have the same cost as the Woad Raider. Their health is the same as that of the Elite Jaguar Warrior and greater than that of the Elite Huskarl and Elite Throwing Axeman and their speed is overall average. This seems to be the core argument behind them being strong.

When combined with the Viking military as a whole, however, they are lackluster. The Vikings have pitiful cavalry, tied with the Koreans and Malay as the worst in the game and their Cavalry Archers are both fragile and slow, being little better than those of the Celts, Franks and Teutons. In addition, the Vikings have among the worst Monks in the game, similar to those of the Celts, Mongols and Persians. The Vikings rely mostly on infantry and foot archers, however both of those groups of units are easily countered with siege and can be harassed by mounted archers, both of which are hard for the Vikings to counter. The health of the Elite Berserk is on par with the health of other Unique Units which do not have a bonus to HP. As such, it does not enjoy a real benefit from that bonus. Finally, Berserks do not stand out in the areas of armor and damage, being roughly average in both areas. All of these things make the Berserk weak.

One of the problems facing the Berserk is its cheap cost, as anyone playing Vikings is not going to throw a bunch of gold into mounted units and Monks, unlike say the Teutons and Japanese. That cheap cost and faster training rate allows for easy spamming, but the quality per unit, when matching up against other civilizations, puts them at a disadvantage. It would appear to be better in many ways for the Berserk to be more powerful and at the same time more expensive, the former addressing its weakness, the latter addressing the spamming issue.

From reading other posts, something tells me that having Berserks cost 75 Food and 40 Gold while improving their stats would satisfy a lot of people and not break anything balance related. A Berserk with 60 (69 CA/72 IA) Health, 12 Attack, 1 Hack Armor and 1 Pierce armor and an Elite Berserk with 75 (90 IA) Health, 16 Attack, 3 Hack Armor and 2 Pierce Armor with the above mentioned cost and all other things remaining the same would seem to be a good solution.